Japanese Militaria at Castle-Thunder.com

[Jareth]

Anyone (means you too Trey) ever seen/own a type 38 rifle with one piece butt stock? I recently bought a 23rd series Kokura with beautifull blonde/honey grained stock that's one piece & double Kokura proofed. If stock is Chinese or Thai then I'd be impressed by the quality of the work & would be even more impressed by the addition of (fake?) crisp/clear Kokura stamps!

[gwsiii]

I've had two, but they were both Chinese, and on import marked guns. I've heard of good ones, just haven't seen one. Trey
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I didn't pay to much for that old Arisaka, I just bought it a little bit too soon!

[Jareth]

Trey, regarding Chinese stocks were they exact, high quality copies? Or could you easily spot the differances? Also was rifle stamped on metal anywhere? And lastly, yeah losts of questions!, where were the import stamps on barrel or? Thanks & happy holidays to you & your family.

[gwsiii]

Jareth, from what I can tell. The current Chinese Repro stocks have non-rounded fullers, they run honey to orange colored, and crudely inletted. Pretty easy to spot. The older ones, (I'll take a picture after while) are honey colored, but have a shiny layer on top of the finish. The 2 of these I've seen both had brands (peoples militia) on the right hand side of the stock, so that's easy to tell too. The overall appearance is good, other than the shiny look, the dove tails are pretty decently done. Inside however its quite crude and easilly noticeable. See ebay 300057035193 for a current Chinese 38 Carbine stock, picture isn't very good, but you can see what I mean about the fullers.

The import marks on the guns themselves are normally on the underside of the muzzle, if a cleaning rod were in it, you might not notice it. I haven't seen them any where else. Sometimes they've been removed, omitted, or just badly stamped. I've seen the import mark placement from there (running counter-clockwise) , 6 o'clock to about 3 o'clock. Some marks list initials of the company and state of import, some give caliber and "Japan". I'd compare the inspection marks to a known 'good' stock, they should be just about identical. Fank can tell you exactly what inspection marks should be there, and probably where most of the 1 piece stocks turn up. Kokura marks would be easy to 'restore' with a couple screwdrivers, I've seen a few that looked like that's how they were done. Nagoya is a little more complicated, but I've seen a few of those that looked like they were done with a screwdriver as well. They were bad. I'm taking Weldon down for some King's Quest 7, in a minute, I'll try and get some shots of the Chinese stock while I'm down there and post later tonight (if I don't fall asleep).

On replacement stocks, that I believe to be Japanese, I've seen some with no external marks, but single inspection marks in the barrel channels. The most interesting replacement stocks are those with 'chatter' in them, from what I can tell, Nagoya replacements are 'spoke shaved' as Doss calls it, like the late Nagoya 99s, and the Kokura stocks most resemble the late Kokura 99 stocks (late, late 23rd, 24th & into the mid 25th series). I've seen a few in what appeared to be Mukden/Hoten stocks with only a single inspection mark, so I assume they are reworks to. I don't think all reworks were re-numbered, or even reassembled with the same numbered parts. More later, Trey
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I didn't pay to much for that old Arisaka, I just bought it a little bit too soon!

[Jareth]

Trey, my rifle is not import marked. Stock never had brands & Kokura proofs are excellent. If anything then there were fakes made of the stamps themselves(die) & then used to stamp on my stock. I plan on removing handguard tomorrow & I'll let you know what I find. Stock is perfectly fitted/inletted. Oh, as for finish the sheen looks just like normal. Not too high gloss but just perfect. I'm really weirded out on this stock!

[DEFUC]

Trey, Didnt that jin 30 that I had for a while have a chinese stock, might be I disremember ,I see too many guns ..that real pretty sort of stripped looking stock???something here had a chinese stock anyway...dave

[gwsiii]

Jareth, your stock is probably good, the Jinsen Dave and I have traded back a forth a couple times, has a chinese stock, its in the middle. Please excuse the repro mount on my Kokura sniper, but it works, and looks fine with scope mounted on it. I've long heard of Japanese 1 piece stocks on production rifles, just never seen one on anything other than a trainer.

You can't tell much from these pictures, I tried them with various 'forms' of lighting, all bad....Rifle with dust cover is Jinsen 38 in Chinese 1 piece stock.




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I didn't pay to much for that old Arisaka, I just bought it a little bit too soon!

[DEFUC]

Ah ha IT did have a chinese stock,I sort of remembered that it did..only thats not the stock I was thinking of ..Im getting old,now to remember where it went,had a dark stripped ,one piece stock with a peoples militia stamp..

[Jareth]

The mystery deepens! I took off hand guard & it's Kokura proofed & matching the rifles assembly number! The hand guard is a perfect match in stain, color, condition etc. as stock!

[gwsiii]

Sounds good...
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I didn't pay to much for that old Arisaka, I just bought it a little bit too soon!

[Jareth]

Trey forgot to thank you for posting those photos. For the moment, & I doubt I'll learn more, I'm convinced I have an original one piece Japanese type 38 stock.

[gwsiii]

Jareth, I think you most likely have a good one. The guys in my neck of the woods aren't big 38 collectors, while Bobby has some nice ones, he doesn't actively seek them out. My 23rd series has a Tokyo Finnish marked stock on it. While its an original stock, I'm guessing its been swapped over here, numbers/marks in barrel channel of stock and handguard have been chiseled out. Trey
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I didn't pay to much for that old Arisaka, I just bought it a little bit too soon!